Minutes for Meeting of 08-30-2000

Hello Ramblers!

GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENTS:

1.) Important: Unless otherwise announced, the meeting place for all hikes is behind the Park Student Union, in the parking lot.

2.) Future hiking club meetings, during the summer, will continue to be held in the Forbes building lobby, in case Forbes, Room 307, isn't available.

ANNOUNCEMENTS CONCERNING LISTSERVE:

List maintenance is done and the list is running again. The primary objective was to reduce the number of people who are dropped from the list due to mail errors at their end. The listserve would automatically unsubscribe anyone whose mail was undeliverable for 4 days. It should now wait for 32 days or 250 errors whichever is first. This is a Ramblers issue because we like to travel. As we are away, mail piles up and reaches the mailbox quotas. Further mail bounces and the listserve starts counting days and errors. Upon returning, the unsuspecting Rambler is no longer on the list. The listserve will still remove subscriptions to addresses, which do not exist or will indefinitely bounce mail. If you are going on a long trip such as 6 weeks in Antarctica, please do the following:

Be sure that your mailbox will not fill up for the first 2 weeks.
Read and delete mail during your trip.
Suspend your Ramblers mail while you are away. This option will cause you to lose mail.

Go to for instructions on this and other useful ways you can modify your subscription. The Ramblers list has had a lot of removal requests lately. Some of these may be from folks who are frustrated with a lot of impertinent messages. Let's try to reduce the amount of mail we send to the ~200 subscribers on the list. Please address mail to specific individuals or groups if your message is not intended for everyone. Do not reply to a listserve message unless you want everyone to receive the reply. Instead, explicitly address your reply to the sender. Please limit the message content to Ramblers business. The Ramblers list is not a chat facility. Be succinct. Please use message subject lines in a way that will allow recipients easy identification of messages to read or delete without reading. Any information, which will reduce the mail reading load, is appreciated. Thank you and enjoy. - Wit

EQUIPMENT WISH LIST:

Here is the current list of equipment items we plan to request in our budget:

1. Backpack tent(s) (sleeps 2 or 3)
2. Water filter cartridges (for existing pump)
3. Sleeping bags (down to 15 degrees F)
4. Stuff sacks
5. Dry (wet?) bags for waterproofing equipment

Please bring last requests to next week's meeting (or put on listserve).

PAST HIKES:

1.) There was one past hike, which Phillip did recently: ***** ***** ***** Hello Ramblers,

Since neither of us can make it to meetings this year, we wanted to tell you about a trip we did this summer up in Wyoming and Montana.

We camped out the first night in Monument Valley on the Arizona/Utah border where we saw our first odd sight of the trip. It was after dark and we were watching the full moon come out over one of the sandstone monuments when we heard a sound coming from somewhere below. I thought it was a deer or a fox running through the desert. Erika suspected it was the Wolfman running around the desert looking for lost campers. A few moments passed by when we realized the sound was coming closer, whatever it was, it was quickly headed right for us! To our relief, it was only a Navajo boy going out for a run out in the desert in the middle of the night.

The next day we drove all the way up to Bear Lake on the Utah/Idaho border. It is a nice place to visit, but I wouldn't recommend any Ramblers hikes there anytime soon. By the time we reached the Grand Tetons, we were ready to get out of the car and do some serious backpacking. So, without any prior knowledge of the park, we decided to go on a 2-day backpack to a place called Surprise! Lake. Well, we started out the day full of energy and enthusiasm. We had been hearing from almost everybody to watch out for bears up there, but, I didn't think we would see one, only because I had been hiking in bear country most of my life and I had never crossed paths with a bear.. Half way up to Grand Teton (well, almost), we turned a corner on the trail, and there was Smokey standing in the middle of the trail looking right at us! Erika got some great pictures of him eating huckleberries on the mountainside. To my amazement, he didn't seem to be bothered by us at all; he just went along eating like we were not even there. A few miles later we finally reached our destination of Surprise! Lake. Not to mention a spectacular view of Grand Teton and her friends. So, we stayed there for a couple of nights. If you ever go up there, be sure to take a dip in one of the two Glaciated Lakes. You might be frozen for a couple of minutes, but it's well worth it.

After we got back from the Tetons, we were not quite ready to go home, so we said, what the hell, let's go to Canada. Well, we got close, 22 miles south of the border to be exact. If anybody plans to go to Glacier National Park anytime soon, be sure to stay in Polebridge, Montana, for at least one night. It is a 20-mile drive on a dirt road through the park. The town consists of a Saloon, a General Store, and an International Youth Hostel, oh yeah, and no electricity. The whole town is run off of generators. I think it really adds to the charm of the place, and anyway, who needs electricity when you have the Aurora Borealis to entertain you at night? By the way, I recommend the local Moose Drool Beer and the Steak at the Saloon. YeeHaw!

On the way back home, we camped out in a smoke cloud from all the wild fires in the area (which looks amazingly like fog!) Little did we know that there were fires all around us that night! We just thought it was one of the pleasant Idaho fogs you always see pictures of. D'oh! So if anybody plans on going up to Big Sky country, we highly recommend that you check these places out.

See ya, Phil and Erika ***** ***** *****

2.) A short ramble to Tanque Verde Falls was lead by Stephen and attended by 12 Ramblers (6 new this semester). We took the lower Tanque Verde Trail to the canyon floor and boulder hopped upstream about 0.5 miles to the falls. There was moderate water flow over the falls and the pool was deep enough to enjoy a swim. One hiker felt dizzy just after the final climb to the falls, but recovered with rest and pouring water over the head. I think it was a bit of heat exhaustion. There were a few scrapes and one small fall, but everyone seem to feel the beauty of the falls made up for the difficulty in navigating the canyon. Robbie's identification of snakes, caterpillars, cactus beetles and insects swimming in small pools drew strong interest and added a lot to the trip. Thanks, Robbie.

Steve

FUTURE HIKES:

1.) Details of Michael's trip (9/1/2000 to 9/4/2000) are as follows:

***** ***** *****
Hello Ramblers,

Here are some details on the Labor Day Weekend trip into Greenlee County and the Blue Range (eastern Arizona, near New Mexico). We'll be driving along The Coronado Trail Scenic Byway (Highway 191, the "old route 666"). Destination is the high-elevation Blue Range around Hannagan Meadow. This is an area of pines, streams, and meadows. A lot of wildlife and wildflowers are in the area. More info is on the web, follow links to trails - Alpine District - Blue Range to find a list and description of hiking trails: http://www.fs.fed.us/r3/asnf/.

Itinerary:

Leave Friday evening Sept. 1 from Park Student Union. Time to be determined, but in the 5pm-6pm vicinity. Drive to Safford. Eat fast food & get gas. Continue on to Clifton - last chance to top off on gas. Continue into Apache-Sitgreaves Nat. Forest and find place to camp on one of the side roads.

Saturday: drive up route 191 (old 666) to the Mogollon Rim and Hannagan Meadow, making some stops and short hikes along the way. We may camp at Hannagan Meadow or someplace before there, if we find a nice spot.

Sunday: drive the short distance to Hannagan Meadow (if we are not already there). Find a campsite there to serve for the evening. We'll then have the whole day to hike on trails leading east of H. Meadow into the Blue Range. There are a lot of trails (#65, 73, 76, 305), several possible loops, and hikers can do whatever trails suit their hiking ability.

Monday: Head back to Tucson. Another interesting area near H. Meadow is the Bear Wallow Wilderness. We may do a hike in there for the morning, before heading home.

Details of the trip:

The driving will be almost entirely on paved roads, except for some trailheads and routes to camping spots. This trip should be suitable for regular passenger vehicles unless they are real low riders.

I've heard there is no gas between Clifton and Alpine. We won't go all the way to Alpine, so it will be a long drive to Hannagan Meadow and back without a chance to refill. If you've got a vehicle with poor mileage it might be a good idea to bring a spare can of gas (I've got one). We should all top off our tanks at Clifton before starting on this stretch.

This will be the end of the monsoon thunderstorm season. Be prepared for rain. Bring a poncho or rain gear, and a tent that can cope. Temperatures may be cool or cold up at Hannagan Meadow (it is high elevation).

This is car camping, so we can keep food in vehicles where bears etc. can't get at it.

Hiking should be moderate to easy "B" level, because it will mostly be short hikes, except on Sunday. On Sunday you can "make your own hike"; do an "A" level hike all day or spend the day around camp doing strolls.

I've never been in this area, so it'll be a bit of an exploratory expedition. Trip plans may change if we encounter bad roads, full campgrounds, forest fires, or inclement weather. But there should be plenty to do up there even if the itinerary needs to change.

Please email me if you are interested in going and if you have a vehicle you can bring. We try to carpool as much as possible, and split the cost of gas. Some car space should be calculated for gear too. Also note what time you could be at the Park Student Union on campus Friday evening. I'd like to leave 5pm-6pm since it will be a long initial drive.

Thanks,
Michael
***** ***** *****

Note: By popular demand, we'll make the departure time 6:00PM on Friday. For more information, contact Michael: chamb@u.arizona.edu.

2.) Lemmon Pools (Santa Catalina Mountains) day hike: Leave Saturday (9/9/2000) @ 10:30AM. Rated "C". Contact Hanna: hanna@u.arizona.edu.

3.) Over night backpacking trip to Pima Springs, up Pima Canyon (Santa Catalina Mountains): Leave Saturday (9/2/2000) @ 8:00AM. Will also include Kimball Peak. Rated "B+". Contact Steve Newcomb: sanewcomb@yahoo.com.

4.) Day hike to 7 Falls, in Bear Canyon (Santa Catalina Mountains): Leave Monday (9/4/2000) @ 9:00AM. Rated "C"; however, bring sunscreen, extra water, swim wear (since there are pools), and rain gear (just in case a summer monsoon hits). Contact Joe Leisz: <jleisz@ag.arizona.edu>.

5.) Updates concerning Massimo's Grand Canyon trip are as follows:
***** ***** *****
Hi Ramblers,

One place become available for the Grand Canyon backpacking trip I am organizing for October. As I expect more places to be available in the next future, I think it is a good idea to start a waiting list for people who are interested in joining the trip if there are some more cancellations.

Here follows some details about the trip. If you want to join the waiting list please contact me by e-mail <malagoli@u.arizona.edu> or by phone (626-6514 office, 529-9527 home).

We have a permit to spend three nights in the Canyon (6th, 7th and 8th of October), so this will be a four days/three nights backpack. We need an additional day to drive to the Grand Canyon, so we will start from Tucson on Thursday the 5th of October in the afternoon, and we will be back on Monday the 9th in the evening.

The backpack will be along the Grandview trail and the Tonto East trail, on the East Side of the South Rim, starting from, and arriving to, Grandview point. For those, who knows about the zoning of the Canyon, our permit is for camping on use areas BE9, BD9 and BE9, see http://www.kaibab.org/bc/gcbcmap.htm for details.

The majority of the participants to this trip, me included, are first timers on the Grand canyon, so I am trying to keep the trip as easy as possible. For the moment the tentative program goes like this (many thanks to Steve for the suggestions): on Friday we will start from Grandview point and hike the Grandview trail down to Hance Creek (6.5 miles, -3800ft), where we will set up the camp. This should take only half of the day, leaving the other half free for people either to rest the sore limbs or to explore Hance Canyon. On Saturday we will hike the Tonto East trail down to the river (6.4 miles, -1000ft), to camp on a beach (I think it's called Red Canyon beach). Again this should take only part of the day, leaving plenty of time to explore the surroundings for those who still have energies. On Sunday we will hike half the way back to the rim, up to Hance Creek or another campsite, with the option of stopping for rest/exploration of side canyons and other interesting places. On Monday we will hike out, send postcards, buy souvenirs, and eventually take a shower at the Mather campground, and then head back to Tucson.

I will be happy to receive comments and suggestions about the program, I know there are many experienced Grand Canyon hikers in the club.

One last word about the rating of the trip. Although I am trying to keep it as easy as possible, this backpack will anyway be about hiking some rough and very steep trails, under the weight of heavy backpacks, so the trip is definitely rated A.

Bye,
Massimo
***** ***** *****

6.) Another backpacking trip is also being planned for the Grand Canyon. The dates are from Friday (12/15/2000) to Wednesday (12/20/2000). The backpack will be down the Bright Angel Trail and to Indian Gardens and surrounding areas. Contact Mead Jordan: mjordan@egret.sao.arizona.edu.

7.) There is also a hike up Wasson Peak in the Tucson Mountains:
***** ***** *****
Ramblers -

I am going to hike to Wasson Peak in Saguaro National Park West this Thursday morning, and would like to invite anyone who would like to come. There is a catch, however, that may make this hike more or less attractive to you - I need to be back at campus by roughly noon, which means leaving campus at 5 AM sharp. This is for two reasons - first, I need to be back on campus then, and second, by getting to the trailhead around 5:30 AM, we will beat the heat while climbing to the summit. I would say that this hike is rated B, although keep in mind that we will also be on a time schedule so maybe it would be rated an upper level B, or something like that. To anyone interested, we will take the Hugh Norris Trail, a 9.8 mile round trip hike with 2100 feet of elevation gain to the summit, and then the same amount of loss returning to the trailhead. We will need to do the hike in about 6 hours, so if you can do 4.9 miles and 2100 feet uphill is 3 hours, and want to get up early, then come along! You will need sunscreen, 3 liters of water or more, food to snack on, a flashlight for the early morning, and rain gear in case of a random morning storm in the Tucson Mountains. We will meet at the parking lot of the Park Student Union and leave at 5 AM sharp this Thursday (Aug. 31) and return by noon. Please contact me with any questions or if you are interested in going. My e-mail is goodwillout@hotmail.com and my phone number is (520)-624-8538. I will also be at the Ramblers meeting this Wednesday, and you can talk to me there. I have room for 4 others in my car, although I doubt that many will show up at 5 AM (if anyone at all shows!). Remember that we will get to see a beautiful sunrise in the Tucson Mountains!

Rob Mason (new to the Ramblers)
***** ***** *****

If anyone wants to post additional announcements for any hikes, etc., please feel free to use the listserve. Meanwhile, keep Rambling!

Wolfgang